If you want to create change in business, you have to disrupt the status quo. Kumar Dattatreyan is dedicated to helping companies and their leaders create innovation and change. We talk about this on his Meridian Point Podcast. Learn and grow from these points:
- Innovate by focusing on culture and process rather than product features.
- Understand how you create value for your customers.
- Brand promises must have consequences if you do not deliver.
- Make culture visible by writing down your core values.
- Leaders need to demonstrate core values first.
- High performing companies hire for culture, then for skills second.
- Are using alcohol to cope with your feelings, including fear?
- My path to recover from alcoholism was through a 12-step program.
- To truly become a great leader increase your curiosity and listening skills.
- To stay accountable, write down your corporate quarterly goals.
- Meet off site quarterly to deal with the brutal facts and adjust your course.
- Alignment is more important than strategy or execution.
Audio
Transcript
Kumar Dattatreyan (00:12):
Hello everyone. This is Kumar Dattatreyan with the Meridian Point, and I’m really excited for today’s guest. We’re joined by David Greer, a 40 year entrepreneur who challenges everything we think we know about innovation. After building and selling a global software company, David argues we’re missing 75% of innovation opportunities by obsessing over technology instead of focusing on culture, people and processes. That certainly resonates with me because I work in transformation. I see this all the time. As an entrepreneurial coach and author of Wind In Your Sails, he brings a unique perspective shaped by 16 years of sobriety and the belief that personal transformation drives business success. David’s here to discuss why disrupting yourself as a leader might be the most important business strategy of all. Without further ado, let me bring David to stage. Thank you so much for being here, David.
David Greer (01:14):
Well, thank you for inviting me. I’m super excited about this conversation.
Kumar Dattatreyan (01:19):
Yes, same. I, I’ve been looking forward to this. This was pinned on my calendar for quite a while, maybe we’ll start with the innovation opportunities sort of lost because many of us, most of us focus too much on technology and not enough on culture, people process, things like that. Can you elaborate on that? I’d love to hear your perspective.
David Greer (01:45):
Sure. Just before we start, I’d just like your listeners to know if there’s some part of our conversation that resonates with you and you want any help, I offer a free one hour coaching call to anyone that wants. I usually say it at the end, but not everybody listens all the way to the end. I just want everyone to know that that offer is available. And if you visit my website, my phone number in my email or there, and for that, we’ll kind get in the conversation, well look at it, let me talk about it in kind of more product and from a sales point of view first, and then maybe we’ll come to people culture. I think when we look at the sales process from initial lead generation, then all the way through the sales funnel, but then equally important, the post implementation and what happens after. I’ve worked in a lot of organizations where salespeople complain we don’t have the feature set of competitor X, competitor Y, competitor Z, and I argue it’s not about feature set. And let me, again, I come more from the business to business background and I come more from the software background.
(03:08):
That’s my background. But to me it’s much more important that you be able to demonstrate the value you can deliver to your client. If you are 10 times better than your competitor post-sale at actually getting it implemented, getting the teams on board, getting the actual value realized in an organization, actually the value that you promised that is way more important than more feature set.
Kumar Dattatreyan (03:39):
That makes sense.
David Greer (03:40):
The way we create belief in that is through customer testimonials and customer references and people, because sure, there’s going to be people in the sales force going to say, well, you don’t have all the features of competitors X, Y, and Z, and you can say, yes, you’re right. We don’t, but we have the features that will make the most difference and add the most value to you and your process in your organization.
Kumar Dattatreyan (04:04):
Yeah, I mean, I think you’re right. It’s all about differentiating yourself in some way. And some companies, some differentiate themselves by having this wide feature set that maybe not everyone uses, but that there are companies that are more focused on what their customers truly need and they focus in on the features that are actually used or actually produce the most value and so on and so forth. That’s what I get out of it is focusing in on what your customer truly needs and really understanding what their needs are and then delivering on that. Right? That’s going to result
David Greer (04:44):
In, and if we get back to disruption and innovation, I think there’s great room for you to innovate about how you demonstrate that through the sales cycle and how you demonstrate that through implementation. And there’s a lot of room for creativity and innovation and disruption through that whole process. In my book, Wind In Your Sails, another area that’s really ripe, I think in a sales process and brand promise is every industry has a deep dark secret. And one of the stories I feature in my book, Wind In Your Sails is the local security company, Provident Security. And in the security business, the dark, dirty secret is that when an alarm goes off, something happens. That’s the secret because what happens is the call center, maybe somewhere in the wilds of Texas, the phone rings and someone answers it or the alarm goes off and someone calls you and maybe you’re a thousand miles from your home At the moment, Mike Yeager, he founded Provident Security with the brand promise “five minutes to your door or your money back,” and then he built a system, which turned out to be quite harder than he thought to actually deliver on that brand promise. Here we have huge disruption to the security industry. You have someone who’s willing to step up and call out the biggest secret.
(06:23):
By making a brand promise that no one else can make. And then he had to massively innovate. I won’t go into all the details. You can read my book. In the book, he did a massive amount of innovation so that he could actually deliver on that brand promise five minutes to your door, how close security guards had to be. It turns out even tracking keys. And it turns out that every security vehicle with the security person from Provident Security has a key to every property they manage, but they’re all coded. The security person can’t collude with someone to break in. There’s just whole innovation just in managing keys to people’s places in this industry,
Kumar Dattatreyan (07:14):
And it’s all started with that promise. The promise that time, minutes is to your door.
David Greer (07:20):
Well, and then something would happen, not only we show up at your door, but if it turns out that they now alarm for water ingress, your toilet line has broken and water started pouring in the house, they now monitor all sorts of things that their customers find important to them while they’re away. That’s in the product brand innovation side. And then you open the conversation talking about people and culture. Well, first of all, I think a lot of companies …
Kumar Dattatreyan (08:00):
Before we go there, just go there. I want to sort of not poke at it, just dive a little deeper. The idea of this brand driving innovation, the brand, the slogan if you will, five minutes to your door, I didn’t think of it that way. Nike, just do it. And this company, Five Minutes to Your Door. It sounds like in this example, it may be an example in your book, the owner, the innovator, this guy, he came up with this catchy slogan and then had to live up to it, and had to go through this cycle of innovation that examined every part of the value chain, if you will. How do we do this? How are we going to get somebody in five minutes to wherever there’s an alarm? But then you have, I don’t know how many examples of that exists. Our brand for the company that I run Agile Meridian, is Deliver Amazing, and that was actually born out of our experience and the kind of work that we do with our clients and we pride ourself in delivering an amazing outcome. But it didn’t start out that way. It was sort of through the experience. I’m just wondering, in your experience with business leaders, what comes first? Is it typically the slogan or is that born out of experience, or does innovation happen when it is sort of this aspirational slogans statement, whatever that drives people to sort of think about how to deliver on those things?
David Greer (09:45):
I’ll bring a couple things. In Mike’s case, I think it was really great companies become great companies because they recognize a pain in the market. Mike recognized that there was this industry secret that for a certain group in the market who were willing to pay more and it was more important to having someone show up was really important to them. That was the pain point. I also want to point out a little difference in Mike’s promise from yours. Mike’s promise, he has a brand promise and a consequence. We show up at your door in five minutes or your money back, and this is where I think a lot of businesses break down, is they don’t have the consequence to their brand promise. And maybe you don’t make it explicit externally, but if you break your brand promise, does the VP of ops get fired? I do a lot of work with teams and with this methodology called Scaling Up from a guy Verne Harnish. And the framework actually has both the brand promise and the consequence. You actually document what happens when you don’t deliver on your brand promise. And this forces entrepreneurs and their teams also to think more. You need to make a brand promise that’s more measurable.
(11:17):
Because how will we know if we delivered it or not? And then what is the consequence inside the company? Does the whole senior leadership team not get a bonus if we 10 times in a month didn’t show up at people’s door in the five minute window? And I don’t know, I mean Mike’s consequence is he costs us some money, I think, but it’s really important to include that second half of his brand promise. But I’m pretty certain that it was driven from a perceived pain point in the marketplace, which is right. People thought something would happen when their alarm went off and then he threw his brand promise and he’s a great marketer, really great marketer. He made people aware of what the industry secret was, and then a certain group of those were like, oh, well, now that I know that, that’s not what I actually expect or want from my alarm company.
Kumar Dattatreyan (12:19):
That makes sense, makes sense. And yeah, we do have a guarantee, although it’s not part of the slogan, but yes, that’s a really good point. It’s being able to live up to it. And I think the difference between ours and the example you gave is a lot more tangible.
(12:35):
The interpretations of delivering amazing could be different based on what you’re delivering and on and forth. But at your door in five minutes is very tangible. It’s like, okay, four minutes and 58 seconds, you made it. Thank you for getting here fast or five minutes and 15 seconds a little late, but at least you got here around the time that you did. And the consequences of that. How do you bonus your people? How do you reward your people? How do you measure performance? Things like that. It all can evolve around that. Alright, culture, people, process.
David Greer (13:16):
Yes, I am a big believer that high performing companies should focus on people and culture.
(13:23):
And I mean some of this is not innovation work per se. Some of it is very disruptive though. For example, I’ll work with new clients and ask what their culture is and well, they’ve never written it down they don’t know what it is. They have some vague idea. And it turns out that every person you ask has a different idea. And this comes from mostly from Jim Collins in the book Good to Great talking about, and he has two exercises. One is if you were going to go to Mars, who are the people in your company who you would absolutely positively make sure was on the spaceship with you? Or that one doesn’t resonate personally with me as well, but the next one does, which is “Who in your company would hire again in a heartbeat and why?” And you identify the person and then you start digging into the why and that will start showing you what’s really important to you and your culture. And I think also people tend to be too altruistic. It has to be Disney, it has to be, some companies worked very well by being assholes. I’m not certain I want to work with them as clients, but that is the culture.
(15:00):
And I think at the start of the process is actually discovering your culture, then getting it written down and making it more explicit and then starting to do things and it’s more discovery process rather than this is the culture we want to have. Because if you want to change the culture, that’s in my experience, one of the single biggest, hardest things to change in our organization. And you means certain senior leaders probably have to move on before you.
Kumar Dattatreyan (15:32):
Well, I mean there’s much of it is tied to, you said it earlier, the reward models and how people are evaluated and how these guarantees are maintained. I mean, the simple example you gave one of the clients that I’m serving now, they’re going through a transformation trying to change how they operate, how they deliver value to their customers. And this is a big company, I won’t mention any names, but quasi government. A lot of the funding comes from the government and they’re going through this change and they’re expecting a lot of behaviors to change just because they said. However, they haven’t changed anything in terms of how people are rewarded, what they mean by certain words, like collaborate and innovative. And the culture hasn’t changed at all. Maybe the focus that the leaders put into certain types of behavior has changed, but it’s not reflected in their paycheck or in the daily interactions that leaders have with the doers, if you will, the managers. And again, it doesn’t change,
David Greer (16:44):
You have to lead by example. When I get deep with culture, with clients, some of them is they need to get open to people calling ’em out when they’re clearly not living the cultural values because people, they sniff it out right away when you say, this is our cultural value. And then your behavior is not consistent with what you said. People are like, well, you don’t actually mean this is not our cultural value. Now let’s flip around to the positive side though. I’ve got a client I’ve worked with for a number of years, they’ve really articulated a really solid set of core values. And we’ve had a couple instances in the last year or where there’s been people issues and I’ve gone back to not the two partners who founded the company, but their first reports and said, okay, you’re struggling with this person. “Is this person living your cultural values?” They’re trying to decide should we let the person go or not? And I just say, the person living your cultural values and in a couple cases within a week the person was gone.
(18:01):
They try to be accommodating and that’s part of their teamwork ethic and part of their culture. But this person was clearly violating their cultural norms and their cultural values they expect. The other thing that’s very disruptive, I think to a lot of organizations who go really deep on this is one of the things I really encourage. One of the things is what actions do you live to demonstrate your core values? For example, if someone really seriously violates a core value, are they fired? I just gave that example. Yes, they did. The flip side of that is do you hire for cultural fit first and skills second
Kumar Dattatreyan (18:45):
Because
David Greer (18:46):
You
Kumar Dattatreyan (18:47):
Interesting point.
David Greer (18:48):
I really encourage people to make that one of their actions is hire for culture first because skills are relatively easy to teach. I mean obviously if you need someone with a computer science degree, they need a computer science degree, but there’s lots of people with computer science degrees. You need people who have the computer science degrees who also fit your cultural values. And you screen first for the cultural values,
Kumar Dattatreyan (19:18):
The companies that we and in high performing cultural organization …
David Greer (19:19):
I’ll just finish this thought and then I’ll turn it back to you. I think when there’s a mistake, they eject the person like a virus.
Kumar Dattatreyan (19:29):
Yeah, I think that’s a really good point. And I’ve seen that as well in companies that are run well that run their companies with a culture first, people first mentality. Let’s make sure we get the right people, the right and the skills, of course the skills are part of it, but they’re not the main part of it. It’s more about fit and even to the point where it’s a fit within the team that they’re going to be on. We’ve worked with clients where we’ve advised them to use various assessment mechanisms to assess not just their skills in terms of the work that they’re going to be doing, more importantly how they fit within the team. Are they going to clash with other members of the team or will they compliment the team because that team is lacking certain emotional social skills, emotional skills, leadership skills, whatever it might be, analytical skills, soft skills. And those companies are much more successful at maintaining and growing this culture of whatever the culture is that they’re trying to grow, right? Collaboration, respect, and blah blah, blah, all that kind of stuff.
(20:50):
I’m going to go to the next question. I agree. Culture is very important, but you have to cultivate it. You can’t just lay a set of edicts and expect that the company will just suddenly adopt those edicts and all will be well. You have to sort of put in some ways to measure how people perform and be willing to get rid of people that don’t live by those values, the culture of values that you’ve instilled. And that will of course set a tone, the types of values that are rewarded, the people are rewarded because of it, because they’re embodying those values. I agree with all that. And I don’t know if in your experience when you’ve seen companies like this, I expect you’re calling them high performing companies, they’re high performing because they deliver value to their customers, external, internal, whatever they might be. Is that generally true?
David Greer (21:53):
Sorry, Kumar, one of our connections is giving problems. You were breaking up much I couldn’t quite make out your last question.
Kumar Dattatreyan (22:06):
The question was more around the correlation between companies that hire for culture, for values and their performance. How do they perform in the marketplace versus companies that hire?
David Greer (22:20):
I think again, if you read like Jim Collins, Good to Great, if you read Scaling Up by Verne Harnish, they give pretty strong examples and demonstrate that the highest performing companies are the ones that put people in culture first.
Kumar Dattatreyan (22:38):
Okay. That’s what I imagine. This also sort of lines up with my experience working at many different companies. I want to shift the questioning to your personal journey. You’ve been very open about your recovery journey and how getting sober 16 years ago was the single biggest achievement in your life. From our last conversation, how did that personal disruption transform you as a leader and why do you think entrepreneurs sometimes struggle with accountability?
David Greer (23:12):
I think those are two separate topics, the recovery piece and the accountability piece. But let me talk a little bit first about the recovery piece. Your listeners probably won’t know unless they read the things you posted on LinkedIn for promoting this event. But I am an alcoholic and I am in recovery thankfully for 16 and a half years now.
Kumar Dattatreyan (23:46):
Wonderful.
David Greer (23:47):
A lot of alcoholics. I was in denial for a very, very long time, at least 20 years. And I’m an example of what is very common, which is a really high performing alcoholic and I drank to, it was rocket fuel, it kept me going, made the highs higher, I made the lows, not low, but in the end I was just trying to cope with feelings that were uncomfortable. Coming into recovery. And there’s two parts coming in recovery. The first part is putting down the drink, which in the huge scheme of things I think is actually the easier part. The harder part is I used alcohol. Alcohol was like the 20% of the iceberg you can see on the surface. And the 80% was the feelings underneath that I didn’t know how to cope with. And the challenge is how do I live life on life’s terms without my solution of choice, which is alcohol? (
25:04):
Because life keeps happening and businesses go bump in the night. That’s what businesses do. Life goes bump in the night, what life does, and I can’t reach for my solution. My recovery is through 12 step recovery and the best known and 12 step recovery group. And in 12 steps we have these 12 steps. And they’re not meant to be read as slogans on a wall. They’re meant to be worked. You actually go and sit down with another recovering alcoholic who’s done it before you and you do the work. And that’s been the biggest, one of the biggest changes for me in 16 and a half years is that personal growth through working the steps, through working with some therapy. I’ve also done relationship work with my spouse of 43 years and all of those, all that work lets me show up much better as an entrepreneur and as a coach and as a leader, I’ve become much, I always was quite people focused, but I would say my listening skills are probably 10X what they were before I went into recovery. My ability to listen to people without judgment and to hold space for them …
Kumar Dattatreyan (26:26):
That is such a critical skill.
David Greer (26:27):
And part of that is is that I’ve been to over 2000 12 step meetings I think are magical because in the middle of a meeting you can hear a pin drop. We are just sitting listening to the person who’s sharing. And even if a third of us, our minds are wandering, we’re still present and we’re still quiet. And there’s not many places where you can go, where people will so attentively, I think listen and hold space for what you’re sharing regardless of what you’re sharing.
Kumar Dattatreyan (27:06):
That’s a powerful thing to be heard and also to listen, to develop that kind of a skill to listen and listen deeply. Those are both really powerful. Powerful. Well, the outcome is of course that you feel heard because there’s this group of people that are really intently listening to whatever it is that you’re saying, whatever you’re sharing. And then that’s a great outcome. And of course the discipline that you have to develop yourself to listen intently and deeply and hold space for the other. And that’s really, I don’t know that I have any.
David Greer (27:44):
I think one of, go ahead.
Kumar Dattatreyan (27:47):
I was just going to say I don’t think I have anything comparable except my training as a coach. It’s helped me listen better, but I’m sure it’s not to the level where that you’ve sort of gone through over the last 16 years on this journey that you’ve been.
David Greer (28:06):
And I want to add, I did formally train with the coaches.com, whose name will come to me. Just one sec. I did take formal coach training and that in addition to all the 12 step work plus 10 years now of coaching, I think one of the most powerful skills we can develop is curiosity, being curious why people behave the way they behave. And that doesn’t mean we don’t hold them accountable, but it’s like if they’re not being accountable, we have to call ’em on it and also have some curiosity about what’s missing or they scared, do they not have enough resources? Is stuff going on at home? Do we just hire the wrong person? They don’t have the skills. You just have to really stay curious.
Kumar Dattatreyan (29:07):
Yeah, for sure.
David Greer (29:08):
Let’s segue to, holding people accountable I think is something that most entrepreneurs have trouble with, most leaders have trouble with because you have to be comfortable in the discomfort of someone holding someone accountable. I think if we start with entrepreneurs, entrepreneurs usually found businesses because they don’t want to be accountable to bosses.
Kumar Dattatreyan (29:34):
Good point.
David Greer (29:36):
Entrepreneurs often see an opportunity in a marketplace, but only about 10% of the population become business owners. We’re a pretty weird bunch. You have to be kind of semi crazy to go start a business.
Kumar Dattatreyan (29:55):
Good point.
David Greer (29:56):
I think that an entrepreneur holding themselves accountable is very challenging. I mean, that’s some of my work as a coach is helping them to be accountable unless you have investors and a board. But most entrepreneurs, owner, founders, like the ones I work with, don’t. And being accountable is very difficult.
Kumar Dattatreyan (30:21):
I agree.
David Greer (30:21):
And when the business grows and when you have a leadership team, if you’re not accountable to them, it stalls the business. You can’t perform at peak performance if the leader is not trustworthy and not accountable to the rest of the team. I mean, there’s just a plateau that you’re going to hit.
Kumar Dattatreyan (30:49):
We have a program that we call the Disruptor Method, and it’s really to help disrupt a leadership team how they operate, how they communicate with one another. And sadly, a lot of companies, medium to large firms, their teams are not really teams or groups of leaders that get together maybe once a quarter talk strategy and don’t get a whole lot done. And the disruptor method is intended to disrupt that and help them sort of develop the capabilities that maybe they’ve lost or forgotten or they just don’t use because the culture doesn’t support it or doesn’t reinforce it. And one of the things that we stress a lot is accountability to each other, to the team and on. And I agree as an entrepreneur myself, it’s hard sometimes for me to hold myself accountable, which is why now I’m happy. I have partners that hold me accountable to the things I say I’m going to do. I wanted to,
David Greer (31:53):
The other piece, again with the Scaling Up framework, I mean, just go back. I’m a big believer in quarterly planning, getting offsite, but I think people seriously underestimate how powerful it is to actually get things written down on a piece of paper and that you can then bring out at every weekly meeting to come together and agree on a short set of goals. I don’t allow more than five major goals for a team for a quarter. And even then that’s a lot. And of course if you work with me, I’m going to make sure the goals are very clear that you got across the finish line or not because sometimes people set goals that are very vague, but even just the process of getting together and writing them down and then meeting again in 13 weeks, that itself helps create a lot of accountability.
Kumar Dattatreyan (32:46):
Yeah, I am with you. We 100%. I want to shift the questions to some, we’re getting a little short on time, I want to shift the questions to something a little bit more fun to get people an idea of who you are as a person, the things that you do. I know that sailing figures prominently in your life, and I’m wondering when you’re out on a nine day solo sailing passage, what business insights come to you that you never get in a boardroom?
David Greer (33:26):
You broke up just a little bit and I had trouble, if you could repeat the question, I’d appreciate it.
Kumar Dattatreyan (33:34):
You’re out sailing, you’re out sailing on a nine day solo passage. What insights do you get that you would not get in a boardroom in an office?
David Greer (33:48):
Okay, whether I’m solo sailing or whether I’m sailing with someone else, part of why I really love sailing is that it boils all of the extraneous stuff away. Because when you’re on passage, you have your boat, you have yourself or you have you and you have your crew and you have to make do with what you have. You can’t invent a different boat and you especially can’t change the external circumstances, which is the wind and the waves. You have to adjust your course to whatever is being delivered to you. Now, I’ve only turned back maybe three or four times in 45 years or of sailing, but in every time, it was absolutely the right thing to do.
(34:54):
And I think the lesson for entrepreneurs and leaders is sometimes when external factors change enough, you shouldn’t just beat your brains trying to go to your original destination. You do need to radically change where you’re aiming for. And even if you don’t make such, even if you continue to go to the destination you’re trying to get to as external factors change, if the wind is behind you in a sailboat that’s a fairly, and the waves are kind of behind you, or at least coming from the back quarter, the that’s a fairly comfortable point of sail and you can actually deal with quite a bit of wind and a fair amount of waves. Now, if that is coming at you directly from the destination you’re trying to reach, that’s a completely different looks and feels completely different. Like you’re going to bash your brains out trying to beat, because one, you can’t sail directly into the wind. You can maybe sail 30 or 40 degrees to the wind direction. And I think, again, the lesson I bring back in business is that when market conditions change, when some of the people leave, when circumstances change in your business, be conscious about what the change, acknowledge the change, don’t ignore it. And it’s very easy to ignore, especially external market changes, and understand, okay, for a long time here it was easy downwind sailing, and now we’re going to have to beat our way to where we want to go, and it’s going to be disruptive and it’s going to be hard, and it’s still worth it because we’re still heading to the right place.
Kumar Dattatreyan (36:45):
That’s great. Great insights. All right, one last question. Strategy, execution, cash or people. If an entrepreneur could only focus on one of those four, which would you choose and why?
David Greer (37:01):
That’s context dependent. I can’t give, this all comes from Verne Harnish and his two books, the Rockefeller Habits and Scaling Up. What we say is strategy, execution, cash, and people are like the four foundations of your house. And if you want to go from a house to an apartment, you have to make your foundation stronger. What you need to do is where is of the four parts of your foundation, which is the weakest, which part do you need to go work on? And I encourage entrepreneurs when I’m doing strategic planning with them, at least for a quarter, try and figure out is it some new key hire that will move the business the most? Well, in that case it’s probably a people or are you going to do a lot of work to identifying your culture and making culture much more alive in your organization? Very much people. Strategy is your plan. Execution is how well you’re actually able to execute against your plan. If you had a solid plan in terms of what needed to happen last quarter and where you were going, but then you fell down and you only achieved half your goals, well your execution sucked. I think you should never be less than 80% if you’re a high performing team. And also, there’s another thing I tell people is it’s an age-old management question. Is it strategy or is it execution? Is it the plan or your ability to execute and make the plan happen? I argue it’s neither. It’s about alignment.
David Greer (38:48):
You need alignment first, then you can do the rest. But if you don’t have you and your senior leadership team on the same page and aligned going in the same direction, you’re not going to go anywhere. And again, if I come back to a water analogy since sailing on the water is my thing, if you’re in a rowboat and everyone is pulling on their ore with no alignment about the timing where you’re going, well, but interestingly, it makes a lot of noise and it makes a lot of splashing and a lot of water and a lot of turbulence. It looks like you’re going somewhere. That’s the thing. It looks like you’re going somewhere, there’s a lot of action, but of course you’re just going in circles because you’re not aligned and you’re not pulling together.
Kumar Dattatreyan (39:38):
I really love that analogy.
David Greer (39:39):
I think you have to start with that alignment piece.
Kumar Dattatreyan (39:42):
Yeah, and I love the analogy. I’m definitely going to use that one. Alright, David, we’re about out of time. What have I not asked you that you’d like to share with the audience?
David Greer (39:57):
Thanks Kumar. I appreciate being here today.
Kumar Dattatreyan (40:02):
Oh, you must not have heard my question. Is there anything that I didn’t ask you that you, sorry,
David Greer (40:10):
I’m still struggling. You’re still breaking up for me.
Kumar Dattatreyan (40:13):
Okay.
David Greer (40:14):
Alright, well it’s challenging for me to hear the question.
Kumar Dattatreyan (40:18):
Got it. Okay. Well we will end here then. Thank you so much for joining us, David. I hope you all enjoyed the show. And sorry about the mic problems. I don’t think it’s on my end, but I’ll have to check that out. But thanks again for watching and we’ll see you next week. Bye-bye.
